@Radical_EgoCom@kolektiva.social Just remember you have to be able to be electable regardless of how liberal you’d like to be. Democrats have been hindered by this reality for decades. 🤔
I'm a socialist.
I am definitely not liberal. I find it insulting when I am mistaken for one.
I don't share political views with Hilary Clinton / Joe Biden / etc. I find them to be enablers of the right wing.
Maybe this can help you understand.
@selzero @Radical_EgoCom@kolektiva.social I looked up some definitions, and I’ll agmit that I did not realize socialism in some defs, included collective ownership, which I’m not sold on. So I admit there is a difference. I was thinking in terms of social benefit, social safety nets, medical programs, education, housing and substinance.
Please describe why you are insulted if mistaken as liberal. A difference I see is private ownership, depending on def used.
https://www.wordnik.com/words/liberalism
https://www.wordnik.com/words/socialism
My definition of socialism linked (more on the thread)
I'm not against markets or private ownership. I believe all our systems should be resources to benefit mankind, instead of mankind being a resource to benefit our systems.
Sometimes markets and private ownership are good.
The insulting part: 2 things and I believe we have a Stockholm Syndrome blindness to them.
1- Normalizing the right by compromising on things.For example. Obama should have gone all out and put in place a universal healthcare system. He should have pushed the system to it's limits in the same way the right is doing about abortion. But he caved to corporate pressure. This compromising with the philosophy that human health is an economic resource is barbaric.
2- Putting the requirements of the systems above the requirements of the people.
Liberals fall inline with industry groups and money, in pursuit of short term profits ahead of human well-being and even long term growth.
Healthcare is a good example, as is adult education.
Freeing people of student debt not only has an up side to their well being, an educated adult population will create economic growth in the long term. But no, the libs won't have it.
The socialists trapped in the DEM party such as Sanders and AOC will push for these things.
The liberals will pay it lip service.
Then they will blame the right and claim they have to compromise.
Meanwhile falling on a middle ground their sponsors conveniently asked them to land on in the first place.
It's insulting to be considered the same as these opportunistic powermongers.
@selzero @Huntn00 @Radical_EgoCom my personal favorite is when they go ahead and blame other Democrats for not being able to get anything done but then scream at us that we should “vote blue no matter who”. How’s that working out for us so far?
@maggiemaybe @Huntn00 @Radical_EgoCom
How about people can vote for WHAT THEY WANT rather than. "don't let the ugly guy in"
@maggiemaybe @selzero @Radical_EgoCom@kolektiva.social Umm, if more people voted Blue, you’d see the Democrats acting more like liberals. They in most places, are always having to look over their political shoulders. I’m not a Demicrat, but I look at the choices, Red is out, Socialist won’t get elected. I’d have voted Sanders if he had won the Dem nomination.
@maggiemaybe @selzero @Radical_EgoCom@kolektiva.social I’m not making excuses. Look at political parties, the balance in Congress, relative level of integrity,, your preference of direction, and make a choice based on who is competitive, ie can get elected. Red has broken bad. Right now blue is the only choice, unless you want to watch the USA likely turn into United Fascist States of America or possibly break apart. And if this is our fate so be it. I’m closer to the end so it will be the young folks headache 🤔
@selzero @Radical_EgoCom@kolektiva.social I want to know how you avoid compromise in a Democratic representative system? There is no such thing as just dictating to the other side (ok tell that to the GOP 🤔) You either have the votes or you don’t. And I believe if the majority would get off their asses and vote, the #GOP would be vanquished as a threat to the country as it currently exists.
I'm not against compromise.
I'm against the liberal method of creating a fake debate knowing full well you are going to land into the middle.
I am behind thought leaders that push for their ideas and may have to occasionally compromise.
But saying human health is "partially an economic market" is not a compromise. It is capitulation.
The DEM party have never really made the case for universal healthcare. The truth is, Liberals don't believe in it.
@selzero @Radical_EgoCom@kolektiva.social 1) First of all If Capitolism can’t be reigned in, then I’m against it. This is probably a given I can’t.
I watched the video linked, and it is good overall, but my critiques are, in a Democracy, in any system, good ideas are good ideas and unfortunately if you want to get things passed in a representative system, compromise is required. This is the structure of Representation and liberals working within it. (Cont)
@selzero @Radical_EgoCom@kolektiva.social 2) In any given district, you either have the votes or you don’t based on the ideas of the politician.
The problem as I see it are voters, bigotry, intolerance and selfishness, but also people who are struggling economically and pick whatever boogey man that’s in (or placed in) their heads.
The direct contributor is Capitolism. And since we can’t seem to control it, the challenge is how to change it, with agreement, and not a revolution. (Cont)
@selzero @Radical_EgoCom@kolektiva.social 3) The big money will fight vigorously to preserve what it has. Revolution followed by anarchy for a time, maybe inevitable. I’m saying now quite often that automation and AI may help reach the tipping point when Capitolism can no longer hold the system as it exists together.
Let's consider these a bit at a time.
The first thing you did is take revolution off the table.
My question is, would this have been your reply upon the very first reading of the declaration of Independence.
If not, why do you believe the monarchs of yesterday are different to the oligarchs of today.
On your point 3, I gave a talk at Tilburg Uni for 2 hours based on just that, that automation should make UBI standard.
Unfortunately, this has happened before.
The printing press, electricity, computing, internet.
The extra value created by extra automation goes to share holders. The populace becomes "shamefully unemployed".
@selzero @Radical_EgoCom@kolektiva.social The difference today, is that as of about 20 years ago, automation was reported to be able to replace 75% of the jobs if business wanted to pay for it. If you look at the trend the middle class has steadily shrunk for the last 4 decades in the US due to job exportation.. Now we are approaching something that simulates the human brain, and all bets are off when the first corporation replaces a job or thousand of jobs, maybe more, with AI driven tech, 🤔
@selzero @Radical_EgoCom@kolektiva.social I did not, have not, taken Revolution off the table, I said it could be inevitable. I don’t believe that would be ideal, but I really can’t claim to know how Revolution would unfold, nor how many would die…🤔
Revolution does not have to be violent.
I am just sick of being told we have to compromise when it comes to:
- Climate change
- Feeding children in poverty.
- Protecting the sick from bankruptcy.
- Investing in adult education for a skilled workforce.
- Increasing the value of labour so it returns more than the value of risk taking.
While trillions in subsidies are signed to Halliburton etc for some shareholder payday.
This is not the compromise I am interested in.
Please don't lump me in with "liberals".
@selzero @Huntn00 @Radical_EgoCom@kolektiva.social In a Representative Democracy, Republic how do you avoid compromise? 🤔 I think we agree we don’t want to go into GOP Power Grab Mode, but if you look at #GOP tactics today, isn’t that what they are doing, forcing their ideology down everyone’s throats?
@selzero @Huntn00 @Radical_EgoCom
It's just amazes me that human decency, morality, and human rights are lumped into compromise. #uspolitics
Jamie
@selzero @jamieannmason @Radical_EgoCom@kolektiva.social before I watch another video, does it tell you how to avoid compromise in a split chamber of Congress? 🙃
@jamieannmason @selzero @Radical_EgoCom@kolektiva.social I agree. The real culprit is Capitalism and profits that Trump everything else. But I am really referencing human beings and the choices they make. “The quality of your life is expendable for my benefit.” If you look at the Constitution, under the GOP and Capitalism, in a civilization of hundreds of millions, a significant segment of them are giving it lip service while actively undermining it. 😬🤔
@selzero @Radical_EgoCom@kolektiva.social Obama pushed as hard as he could. You either work within the agreed to structure and get what you can get, or you do as the GOP is currently doing, breaking the system in an attempt to hold power. Once we start start down the cheat to win path, either the majority throws out the cheaters, or there is a breakdown, and imo, it will be surprising in any drastic change, if there is not much bloodshed. That could end up being inevitable. 🤔
Obama did not push for universal healthcare AT ALL.
@selzero @Radical_EgoCom@kolektiva.social because it would not have passed?
@Huntn00 @Radical_EgoCom
I don't want to be liberal. I'm a socialist.